Just picked that up. No more cowboy hats for Prezza then
It is absolutely typical of New labour that having screwed up the real economy they are covering it up with slash and burn measures like this. In this country we spend £60bio pa on food and £53,bio on gambling the vast majority of which is from underprivileged homes who become addicted . Do they not care what they do to us.
Manchester will never be Las Vegas it will be the crime centre and god awful abyss it is now but with even worse problems for its many poor areas.
Theer is a very important difference between markets and gambling that I do not have the time to go into but it a crucial one . If you can seriously think of one good thing about this then I will have to listen but to me it is absolutely New Labour . Take a Slum add some lights defraud the working class and retire to America
Ancoats is a pretty interesting area, it escaped the 1960's clear out of victorian buildings and has the northern "black lubyanka" the old express building a gem of art deco architecture. See , beneath this harsh granite faced gritty northern exterior a limp wristed effete southern aesthete is struggling to get out.
N - I am going to have to disagree with you on that one.
I have been into casinos in the UK - and while it is not my scene, I regard casino gambling as no more necessarily a road to rack and ruin than betting on nags, the lottery etc etc. I do not believe that there was a vast surge in degenerate gambling after the legalising of off course betting, and as to such criminality as might be associated with the Manchester casino - ladies of the night, money laundering etc etc - it would be incumbent on the puritan element to persuade me that a new market can be created, rather than existing Johns, fraudsters and the like transferring their 'business' from elsewhere. There is an overarching argument about having the personal liberty to spend one's money as one sees fit, and I do not suppose that I need to go into that right now.
Every morning, I race to my computer in bright-eyes hopeful anticipation that Tony Blair has suffered a terrible tragedy - you know, like death - only to read of an obscene new outrage he has inflicted on the citizenr of this country. If it's even a country any more. Are the Irish going to allow us to have elections, then? Self-rule for Britain? The wholesale import of gambling sleaze and crime. A 70,000 person mosque in London.
You won't believe me, but I foresaw all this the first time I ever set eyes on him. Not the details, but I saw the malice and the evil surrounding him and I knew he was going to destroy my country.
Verity As god seems to make a bit of a habit of collapsing mosques when full either via earthquake, terrorist outrage or f16 I am all in favour of the Mohammedans building the places as large as possible.
I am with C. Nothing wrong with extending gambling and to say it brings rack and ruin is a socailist argument. You are in effect saying people are unable to look out for themselves of their financial affairs.
Having said that, the sad cash-dance the government has been doing with the industry lobby here, headed by bell POttinger surprise surprise, is a sad endictment on them.
Where is the clamour for this legislation outside of the industry? There is none.
This is about Nulab donations and more time occupied in parliament with side issues instead of discussing iraq, pensions, inflation, healthcare, prisons, immigration, transport, defence spending, constitutional reform, Northern Ireland, the enviroment, plannign policy (out of time, this list could gon on as we all know) to which Nulab have no answers.
City Unslicker - It's not the rack and ruin that worries me. Some people are weak and will become addicted, but most won't. It's the element that casinos of this type bring in. Trust me, the Mafia will already be scouting for nice properties in the area.
Expect a lot of people wearing concrete Wellington boots to end up in the Manchester Ship Canal.
I wonder what kind of a deal they've cooked up with Anschutz. For sure, there is some giant cover-up woven into this. It will begin to come out around two years from now, is my guess. When Blair is long gone to somewhere where he can't be extradicted. Of course, a Tory prime minister with any nous (sadly, that disqualifies Dave) would simply hint that MI6 should pop over and pay him a visit. Tee hee. Oh, well, dreaming again.
I do not suppose that I need to go into that right now.
Good ! Leaving the field clear for me to win. It is perfectly obvious that the national Lottery has created a new dependency, have you been to a post office recently ? A "Super Casino, like any new brand will transfer some existing consumers and attract some new ones . Nothing is produced; no skills developed no social benefit at all. The poorest are vulnerable and the government wants to tax it. I am aware that you are so wedded to the Libertarian ideal that you would have Heroin stocked in Woolworths but this dangerous anarchy is not liberating it is imprisoning .In this case it is the thinly disguised state seeking to disguise its predations under the gossamer thin veneer of “Liberalising”. Its much the same as Liberalising immigration Freedom is something given by laws. It is not aright it is a creation of society and we tend to it like rare plant by such measures as NOT allowing the strong to prey Upon the weak. What next , free to buy a tank drive it up the road and demands money with menaces. I must say I do like this not going into things
See , beneath this harsh granite faced gritty northern exterior a limp wristed effete southern aesthete is struggling to get out.
Aha many a true word PHITCH of course we do not know what you look like but it is possible you are not like Peter Kay at all.
It is likely you are delicately boned,with a full ruddy lip and soulful sloe black eyes. A faun caught in a moment of apprehending the transcendent beauty of the morn. There you spy the unadorned languorous from of David Cameron bathing ..and charm from an Arcadian pipe a note of such delicacy , such longing …it calls softly to him through the heavy scented air……………………. I love you....
No, no, no, no, NO. We have our freedom before the laws, not vice versa. Laws, ideally, are agreed upon to circumscribe the actions of ourselves and others. The whole point of the common law is that we may do whatever we please unless specifically forbidden to do so. Your argument about the casino business being, if I might paraphrase, being parasitic, could be said of many other forms of entertainment. We can't all make steel, till the earth or dig for coal, can we?
If you men we are born free ontologically you for all I know be right. If you mean it effectively then you are wrong . We are born the heir to a thousand rules and enslavements . The is called culture. Freedom from them is called anarchy .Common Law evolved during a feudal period when the whole of ones existence and even comprehension of the cosmos was a system of duties and loyalties “kindly inclinings “ to which all were enslaved under the Kings Peace. Common Law just decided whose pigs they were. Noone would have even suggested that anarchy of the Croydonian sort was desirable and it still is not . Gambling is somewhere between a drug and a game . It is not entertainment except in a broad and valueless sense. It is the freedom to introduce a drug into the lives of those that are vulnerable to it . In particular the freedom of the state to create what is , a new tax on the poor to run alongside the disgraceful Lottery Monopoly.
That is what this is all about but you are so enslaved to the symbols of Liberty that you cannot be trusted to think without my guidance.
OK, take away the fact that it is taxed, and where is the profound ethical difference between staking a fiver on the roulette wheel, or buying a fiver's worth of raffle tickets? I'm all ears.
Mr Mania you have us Northerners all wrong. If David Cameron sat around Manchester playing some whistle and wearing a pair of goat legs he would be beaten to death by the locals within 5 minutes "just in case" Another true Hitchens story, the Salford police used to keel haul certain villains in the river Irwell right into the 1950's 60's . I know this to be true as Granpa Hitchens was a detective on the City of Manchester police force , even he thought that to a be a bit harsh.
"just in case" oh ho ho I like that...but I still have a feeling about you two younguns ( PHITCH and CAMERON sitting in a tree...)
Roulette is exactly the same as the Lottery ( raffle) C which is why it is time to draw a line .Its a matter of degree , balance and context ,think structurally instead of legally and you`ll get it ....eventually.
Take freedom. If some one think he can fly because he has been taught that he can ( ie gamblers will win). Is his mutilated corpse lying at the bottom of the cliff "Free".Thats what this is . Selling dreams and lies...opium in a circus and taxed to buggery.
Flying ..hmmm..reminds me of Dumbo who was also ( nearly) all ears
Lost me here C ?
Manchester has won the casino licence, and Ancoats etc looks to be the place where they will build it. There was also a sly reference to Elvis.....
Just picked that up. No more cowboy hats for Prezza then
It is absolutely typical of New labour that having screwed up the real economy they are covering it up with slash and burn measures like this.
In this country we spend £60bio pa on food and £53,bio on gambling the vast majority of which is from underprivileged homes who become addicted . Do they not care what they do to us.
Manchester will never be Las Vegas it will be the crime centre and god awful abyss it is now but with even worse problems for its many poor areas.
Theer is a very important difference between markets and gambling that I do not have the time to go into but it a crucial one . If you can seriously think of one good thing about this then I will have to listen but to me it is absolutely New Labour . Take a Slum add some lights defraud the working class and retire to America
Damn then , damn them all to hell …!!
Morrisey is more of a viva canal street sort of chap.
Manchester is becoming the UKs second city.
Unfortunatley it is still populated by oafs.
Ancoats is a pretty interesting area, it escaped the 1960's clear out of victorian buildings and has the northern "black lubyanka" the old express building a gem of art deco architecture.
See , beneath this harsh granite faced gritty northern exterior a limp wristed effete southern aesthete is struggling to get out.
N - I am going to have to disagree with you on that one.
I have been into casinos in the UK - and while it is not my scene, I regard casino gambling as no more necessarily a road to rack and ruin than betting on nags, the lottery etc etc. I do not believe that there was a vast surge in degenerate gambling after the legalising of off course betting, and as to such criminality as might be associated with the Manchester casino - ladies of the night, money laundering etc etc - it would be incumbent on the puritan element to persuade me that a new market can be created, rather than existing Johns, fraudsters and the like transferring their 'business' from elsewhere. There is an overarching argument about having the personal liberty to spend one's money as one sees fit, and I do not suppose that I need to go into that right now.
Every morning, I race to my computer in bright-eyes hopeful anticipation that Tony Blair has suffered a terrible tragedy - you know, like death - only to read of an obscene new outrage he has inflicted on the citizenr of this country. If it's even a country any more. Are the Irish going to allow us to have elections, then? Self-rule for Britain? The wholesale import of gambling sleaze and crime. A 70,000 person mosque in London.
You won't believe me, but I foresaw all this the first time I ever set eyes on him. Not the details, but I saw the malice and the evil surrounding him and I knew he was going to destroy my country.
Verity
As god seems to make a bit of a habit of collapsing mosques when full either via earthquake, terrorist outrage or f16 I am all in favour of the Mohammedans building the places as large as possible.
I am with C. Nothing wrong with extending gambling and to say it brings rack and ruin is a socailist argument. You are in effect saying people are unable to look out for themselves of their financial affairs.
Having said that, the sad cash-dance the government has been doing with the industry lobby here, headed by bell POttinger surprise surprise, is a sad endictment on them.
Where is the clamour for this legislation outside of the industry? There is none.
This is about Nulab donations and more time occupied in parliament with side issues instead of discussing iraq, pensions, inflation, healthcare, prisons, immigration, transport, defence spending, constitutional reform, Northern Ireland, the enviroment, plannign policy (out of time, this list could gon on as we all know) to which Nulab have no answers.
PHitch - That is a good point. Seventy thousand at one go!
City Unslicker - It's not the rack and ruin that worries me. Some people are weak and will become addicted, but most won't. It's the element that casinos of this type bring in. Trust me, the Mafia will already be scouting for nice properties in the area.
Expect a lot of people wearing concrete Wellington boots to end up in the Manchester Ship Canal.
I wonder what kind of a deal they've cooked up with Anschutz. For sure, there is some giant cover-up woven into this. It will begin to come out around two years from now, is my guess. When Blair is long gone to somewhere where he can't be extradicted. Of course, a Tory prime minister with any nous (sadly, that disqualifies Dave) would simply hint that MI6 should pop over and pay him a visit. Tee hee. Oh, well, dreaming again.
I do not suppose that I need to go into that right now.
Good ! Leaving the field clear for me to win. It is perfectly obvious that the national Lottery has created a new dependency, have you been to a post office recently ? A "Super Casino, like any new brand will transfer some existing consumers and attract some new ones .
Nothing is produced; no skills developed no social benefit at all. The poorest are vulnerable and the government wants to tax it. I am aware that you are so wedded to the Libertarian ideal that you would have Heroin stocked in Woolworths but this dangerous anarchy is not liberating it is imprisoning .In this case it is the thinly disguised state seeking to disguise its predations under the gossamer thin veneer of “Liberalising”. Its much the same as Liberalising immigration
Freedom is something given by laws. It is not aright it is a creation of society and we tend to it like rare plant by such measures as NOT allowing the strong to prey Upon the weak.
What next , free to buy a tank drive it up the road and demands money with menaces.
I must say I do like this not going into things
See , beneath this harsh granite faced gritty northern exterior a limp wristed effete southern aesthete is struggling to get out.
Aha many a true word PHITCH of course we do not know what you look like but it is possible you are not like Peter Kay at all.
It is likely you are delicately boned,with a full ruddy lip and soulful sloe black eyes. A faun caught in a moment of apprehending the transcendent beauty of the morn. There you spy the unadorned languorous from of David Cameron bathing ..and charm from an Arcadian pipe a note of such delicacy , such longing …it calls softly to him through the heavy scented air……………………. I love you....
That’s my theory
No, no, no, no, NO. We have our freedom before the laws, not vice versa. Laws, ideally, are agreed upon to circumscribe the actions of ourselves and others. The whole point of the common law is that we may do whatever we please unless specifically forbidden to do so. Your argument about the casino business being, if I might paraphrase, being parasitic, could be said of many other forms of entertainment. We can't all make steel, till the earth or dig for coal, can we?
If you men we are born free ontologically you for all I know be right. If you mean it effectively then you are wrong . We are born the heir to a thousand rules and enslavements . The is called culture. Freedom from them is called anarchy .Common Law evolved during a feudal period when the whole of ones existence and even comprehension of the cosmos was a system of duties and loyalties “kindly inclinings “ to which all were enslaved under the Kings Peace. Common Law just decided whose pigs they were.
Noone would have even suggested that anarchy of the Croydonian sort was desirable and it still is not .
Gambling is somewhere between a drug and a game . It is not entertainment except in a broad and valueless sense. It is the freedom to introduce a drug into the lives of those that are vulnerable to it . In particular the freedom of the state to create what is , a new tax on the poor to run alongside the disgraceful Lottery Monopoly.
That is what this is all about but you are so enslaved to the symbols of Liberty that you cannot be trusted to think without my guidance.
Anyway you were not discussing it !!
OK, take away the fact that it is taxed, and where is the profound ethical difference between staking a fiver on the roulette wheel, or buying a fiver's worth of raffle tickets? I'm all ears.
Mr Mania you have us Northerners all wrong.
If David Cameron sat around Manchester playing some whistle and wearing a pair of goat legs he would be beaten to death by the locals within 5 minutes "just in case"
Another true Hitchens story, the Salford police used to keel haul certain villains in the river Irwell right into the 1950's 60's .
I know this to be true as Granpa Hitchens was a detective on the City of Manchester police force , even he thought that to a be a bit harsh.
"just in case" oh ho ho I like that...but I still have a feeling about you two younguns ( PHITCH and CAMERON sitting in a tree...)
Roulette is exactly the same as the Lottery ( raffle) C which is why it is time to draw a line .Its a matter of degree , balance and context ,think structurally instead of legally and you`ll get it ....eventually.
Take freedom. If some one think he can fly because he has been taught that he can ( ie gamblers will win). Is his mutilated corpse lying at the bottom of the cliff "Free".Thats what this is . Selling dreams and lies...opium in a circus and taxed to buggery.
Flying ..hmmm..reminds me of Dumbo who was also ( nearly) all ears
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